Jen Geigle Johnson: What to do When God is Silent
After being hospitalized for COVID Jen found she had a hard time thinking clearly and even discerning God’s presence. She pressed forward in faith despite difficult challenges and found a powerful answer.
Episode Discussion Points
How she spent a few summers kayaking along the Thames.
How her author job and keeping up with her six children keeps her busy.
How her really bad case of COVID changed her body and triggered an abnormally high cortisol/high stress response in her body.
An experience in the hospital while she had the fuzzy brain COVID stuff and she felt alone and far from God.
“it takes mental concentration to receive revelation that’s like truth or thought.”
She couldn’t pray long prayers when she was brain fuzzy at the hospital, so she leaned on her husband (via text) to help her pray and discern what she should be doing.
Even when she couldn’t feel God at that point, she knew He was there.
How she had people praying for her during her daughter’s weddings to have a “bubble of the Spirit” around her when she wasn’t functioning 100%
Her answer from God—“Just focus on the Joy”
Sometimes God places you in situations where you can’t do it on your own, so He will reach you in the way you need to be reached. God keep trying.
"When you’re perfectly healthy, you can handle a lot, but when your not, you need to become more aware of how these things are effecting your whole body makeup.”
She has now experienced social anxiety and has a lot more empathy
How sometimes prayer, scriptures study don’t work the way we want—we need to tack on “keep going even when you don’t feel the help or answers” with the hope that God will answer/help eventually.
“God will reach you but it may be in the way you aren’t expecting.
Look for the joy and see the miracles that might not be super-obvious.
Look for the little whisper of inspiration from God which may change your perspective when things aren’t getting fixed.
You can’t really measure the value of someone’s love…empathy…hard times.”
We accumulate knowledge and experiences which help us become more.
How Jesus Christ has perfect empathy for each of us. “Christ’s empathy is emboldened because He knows all of our stories.”
Take time to hear people and their stories.
We all want to know we are making a difference—even when you can’t feel Him.
Tips for Reducing Stress
Support network--Ask for help—people to be your “pray-ers”
Talk to you family and friends about the emotions you are processing so that they can help how they can.
Name emotions and process them with God’s help
Positive Mantras--Focus on the Joy
Be okay slowing down during crisis
Meditation/Prayer/Scripture Study—way to receive revelation (because you are quieting distractions).
Calm body, focus on breathing
Watch what thoughts enter a quiet mind—push out the pointless worries and instead focus on positive things.
“Nope. I’m only thinking about breathing right now.”
“Think about a joyful time.”—these are often the things that mean the most too us—the personal interactions (children, friends)
Favorite Bible Verse
Genesis 39 “And the Lord was with Joseph.” (even though Joseph was sold into slavery, and plus in prison.)
God is with us in the details of our lives—throughout the hard times.
Sometimes God’s purposes can’t be seen for a long time.
Connect with Jen
Buy physical copies of her books at Deseret Book or Seagull Book
Social Media @JenGeigleJohnson
#tamarakanderson #storiesofhopeinhardtimes #podcast #hope #God #hardtimes #hospital #COVID #faith #answer #keepgoing #seekjoy #illness #sick
Transcription
You can find the transcription of today's episode here:
Jen Geigle Johnson 0:00
If I knew by faith that God was there, because I trusted Him and I've had in life experience that tells me he is even though I can't feel Him or do the work required to reach out, but at the same time, I wasn't feeling that response the the reaction or the reassurance that yes, your faith is real and so I just was walking on really blind faith and emotionless faith. Just I knew he's there, he has to be there, and I knew I would be okay.
Tamara Anderson 0:36
Welcome to Stories of Hope in Hard Times, the show that explores how people endure and even thrive in difficult times, all with God's help. I'm your host Tamara K Anderson. Join me on a journey to find inspiring stories of hope and wisdom learned in life's hardest moments.
Tamara Anderson 1:01
My guest today is an award winning author, including the gold in foreword indies Book of the Year and LDS PMA praise worthies top award for romance. She has more stories circulating in her brain than can possibly be told. She discovered her passion for England while kayaking on the teams near London as a young teenager. History is her main jam. And her literary heroes include the greats, Jane Austen and Charles Dickens. But she has modern sensibilities as well. six children and an inspiring husband keep her going and make certain she doesn't stay glued to a keyboard, or lost in obscure fascinating details of old castles. Now, she loves to share bits of history that might otherwise be forgotten whether in Regency England, the French Revolution or colonial America, her romance novels are much like life is supposed to be full of adventure. I am pleased to present Jen Geigle Johnson Jen, are you ready to share your story of hope?
Jen Geigle Johnson 2:06
I'm so happy to be here. And I do have to say I could listen to your voice all day long. In a full way of speaking, I get your point. You just making me all at ease over here.
Tamara Anderson 2:17
Oh, well, good, that's the point. It's like we're sitting across the kitchen table having a chat. Right.
Jen Geigle Johnson 2:23
I love that thought. Excellent.
Tamara Anderson 2:26
Well, I have to just ask a little bit of a probe into this story of you discovering England kayaking on the teams, what in the world is that about? Seriously?
Jen Geigle Johnson 2:37
Oh, it's just so fun when my dad worked in a job that transferred him all the time. So I'm one of those people that moved a lot as a kid and one of the places we got to be for about a year and a half was England outside of London. And they put us up in his rental home that was like a mini mini mini English estate. So it's like a normal size house but had this yard that backed up to the Thames River. And my parents were just fully American, right. I don't think the British neighbors ever kayaks on the Thames. And kayaks and like a paddle boat and we were full on playing in the backyard. And we would just lowered into the water and I my parents let me just go I was about 13 or 14. And let me just ride down the river and I would go all the way to the High Wycombe locks.
Jen Geigle Johnson 3:27
And the locks are a system of you know, leveling of water so big boats can come in and out and I would lift my kayak out and walk drag it along the grass and put it in past the locks and just keep going. It was beautiful English countryside is stunning. And I felt like I was on this adventure. And I don't know what the wealthy yachts next to my kayak thought of this little girl in this little boat rolling along. But it was really really beautiful for me and lots of quiet moments to think about life and just fell in love with England. I feel at home there. It feels like a second home for me. So I just happened.
Tamara Anderson 4:06
That is so cool. Is that what then led you to writing and exploring characters and Regency romance?
Jen Geigle Johnson 4:14
Yeah, I think so I felt very, like I could picture the places in my mind when I would read even though regencies are written in 18, early 1800s. I still could picture these estates and these homes and I was fascinated with the lifestyle and I read a lot of Jane Austen who was a contemporary author of the same kind of stuff. So I think so my love of England has kept me in that country almost exclusively. I have a couple of visits over to France. I have a Scarlet Pimpernel retelling and I have some
Tamara Anderson 4:44
which is excellent. By the way. I've got one
Jen Geigle Johnson 4:47
It's one of my favorites, I have to say. And then I stopped in Salzburg for my I wrote a song of Salzburg. It's a book that goes up into that area of Europe but really I stay close to England and I'm sure my roots They're my early years kind of influenced that for sure.
Tamara Anderson 5:04
Oh, my goodness, well, that is so fun. So kind of catch us up on where you are in your life, and then how COVID kind of shook things up a bit for you.
Jen Geigle Johnson 5:15
So I do need to say, I know my, what I'm about to say is gonna sound probably normal to a lot of people. And in some ways, I guess that's good. We all relate. So I hope that something I say is useful, but it probably won't sound very unique. But I so what have I been doing? I've been working really hard. So up until early COVID time, I I'm a full time author. So I spend most of my day writing or marketing or researching or something related to my book job, and it's self inflicted hours. I I love it. And I It does require a lot out of me. I chaired a writing conference here in Texas, I go to multiple writing conferences, I teach workshops, and I do multiple things. And I love all of it. And I crave a really active and healthy lifestyle.
Jen Geigle Johnson 6:04
Along with the things going on at home, I have my six kids and going and going on missions and all those things. But you know, then the year 2020 hit, or 19, whatever it was, it feels like a blur of yours. I for some reason, got a really hard case of COVID I believe it was the end of it was the start of the new delta thing that was going on. And they never officially diagnosed me with that. But I was kind of in the low in between the two different strands. And so they suspect that possibly I had that but I was in the hospital. And I just it lingered and lingered and lingered and lingered for months not hospital, but my whole illness.
Jen Geigle Johnson 6:45
But what happened was a weird thing with my cortisol so that it it just affected my stress levels and my adrenal function and some health issues that were long term. So everyone talks about long term stuff. And it was really tricky because I have felt and I couldn't keep up my normal pace of things because my I would react with a high stress response that I you know, everybody feels stressed. But this was like, I don't know what like to stress on steroids really literally probably on steroids, like literally spiked. So the smallest things would just feel so hard. And like I just had to like I had to push through some book deadlines, because deadlines are deadlines.
Jen Geigle Johnson 7:31
And I had both my darling daughters get married the same weekend that summer. And I had my son go on a mission three weeks later to Ethiopia, and some significant family stuff going on with the with the extended families I it's just personal stuff. And it was all this everything at once and really, really hard to do the normal life. And then I had some really wonderful but stressful things to accomplish. In addition to like my normal 40 hour a week writing stuff that I take on because I loved right so anyway, that was my an explanation of what I was feeling. It was the oddest thing, and I'm still dealing with it right now, not as strongly, but it was the oddest thing in the world to just wake up stressed to have a normal conversation with someone where I'm feeling perfectly fine. And then the tiniest little trigger and all of a sudden, I've got tight chest and I can hardly breathe. And I'm like, stress like this hits you and wake up in the mill the night stressed or you know, and I've learned a lot about recognizing what's going on inside me naming it and then understanding how to break out of those feelings.
Jen Geigle Johnson 8:50
Because sometimes they're just simply chemically created. And your mind though, looks for a reason for you to be having this feeling. And so all kinds of stuff, oh, I'm stressed because of this. But really, I wasn't really stressed because of that I was stressed because my body is just feeling stressed. So it was interesting the cycles that your brain does too. And as I tried to like quiet the mind it's remarkable to me the things that that swim back in in like a massive circle a cycle of stress that you your mind just sort of deals with or thinks about that you don't even realize are affecting you and your positivity and your happiness and oh, it's tiring even thinking about it.
Tamara Anderson 9:36
Oh, it sounds like it. No that that is so interesting because I know that I had COVID A couple of times and it triggered an inflammatory response in me which sounds kind of similar and to your but mine. It triggered my chronic migraines. And so I totally understand it's interesting how COVID kind of hit and miss on different people and it affected some see dramatically and some like not at all, you know. And that's frustrating that it triggered this stress response in you this fight or flight that you just haven't been able to turn off. And that would be so frustrating because I know that I deal with anxiety. And so what you're describing to me, is totally familiar to me. And I understand it pretty well. You know, that racing heart, there's times that I'm going to bed, I'm almost asleep, and all of a sudden, it'll hit me and I'm like, I'm wide awake with my heart pounding. I'm like, why am I stressed? I shouldn't be stressed.
Tamara Anderson 10:35
So I, I hear you and I feel you. And so I would love to hear I know, you mentioned that, that that naming it and trying to do some meditation techniques have been helpful. But I'd love to hear the things that you have found helpful to kind of get that stress response to calm down, because I think we live in a world where we're all dealing with constant stress. And any tips you can share are most welcome. Especially how you involve God in it, because I'm sure there were some lengthy conversations in there. With God going Hello. What is this? What exactly?
Jen Geigle Johnson 11:16
Yeah. So Okay, a couple of things. Where to Start, there's some really fun things I'd love to share. So the the interesting relationship with God, it was a frustrating thing happened, I was in the hospital. And you probably remember those of you who had this happen when you have COVID, your brain kind of shuts down, you don't think clearly you have just really a fuzzy, fuzzy brain. I remember them asking me over and over again what my birthday was. And they would say, Oh, it's just normal protocol. We're supposed to ask your birthday every time we come in the room. And they were just making me feel better. Because after I started knowing my birthday, they stopped asking my my my birthday. They were just being nice to me. But really, and truly, I couldn't remember my birthday. I just I would say it as a muscle memory reaction to their question. And it was not clear in my mind what my birthday was.
Jen Geigle Johnson 12:09
So I was having this this interesting response. And I was by myself because they weren't allowing people in with you, of course, when you're in the hospitals COVID. And therefore they were asking me medical questions like, What should we do now, or we want to do this test, or we want to give you this drug. And I was having to know and respond without knowing having anyone helped me with the fuzzy brain. So the reason I bring this up is because I also felt very far from the spirits. And it was my faith that I knew God was there, but I couldn't really feel him and I couldn't receive. It takes mental concentration to receive revelation that's like truth or thought. And that concentration wasn't there.
Jen Geigle Johnson 12:55
And so I would I remember texting my husband being like, I can't, I have no gut feeling here, I have no inspiration that I'm recognizing, and I can't focus enough to really pray long prayers. Like so, here's what you need to do, you know, kind of like, can you be my prayer? Can you help this revelation for me? So, in my relationship with God was interesting during that time, and I have heard that people with depression and anxiety have a hard time understanding or feeling the spirit kind of consistently. And so I have, I have a lot of empathy for that. Understanding how lost I felt and lonely, and when that help, I felt I knew by faith that God was there because I trusted him and I've had a life experience that tells me he is even though I can't feel Him or do the work required to reach out.
Jen Geigle Johnson 13:48
But at the same time, I wasn't feeling that response, the the reaction or the reassurance that yes, your faith is Israel. And so I just was walking on really blind faith and emotionless faith. I just, I knew he's there, he has to be there. And I knew I would be okay. So there were a couple things that were helping me but so but after that experience, where I felt really far away, ish, you know, emotion wise, I then turned back to him and he found, you know, was able to function more normally when my brain started to work better. And through those times, I basically just basically just said, Please carry me, especially to the weddings.
Jen Geigle Johnson 14:31
I remember asking my extended family, my brothers, my sisters, my parents, okay, everybody pray that I just have that bubble of happiness. That, you know, responds politely to people that handles emergencies. You know, you and your daughters get married, they look to their mom to smooth things over. A mom at a wedding is the invisible proactive device. I don't know what else to call it, like, you know, she's just back there putting out All kinds of fires and smoothing things over. And so I felt direct response to those prayers. And I had my cute nieces and nephews telling me they're praying for me and I had all that I call it the bubble of the Spirit that just shields you from some of the sharper things that might be coming, and was able to respond and function and meet booked deadlines and all those things. Because I just basically said, I have these things that have to be done, I care a lot about all of them, and I am unable to do it. And you know, this is where I just need someone to help and step in. So Heavenly Father did, as he does, and I was so grateful.
Jen Geigle Johnson 15:39
The the wedding's went great. And I was gifted with a revelation that just focus on the joy. There's a lot to see. And this this has carried over through the rest of my life living, there's a lot to see everything around you that you can pick and choose what your focus is. And with a wedding, just like life, there's crazy things that happen. There's emergencies, there's people upset, there's contention, there's stress, but there's so much joy, and the the revelation I received was just focused on the joy. And I realized, you know, they're gonna get married, the only thing I care about here, and there was so much joy, the little things didn't matter that, you know, there was just everything else just fell away. And that is just a life lesson that I've carried I just one of the, you know, as your one thing I'll talk about too, if you're, if you're interested in these tips and tricks is, it's just a lot about thought control as well, there's not much you can do about body chemistry, besides the health things that you need to do to make yourself healthy.
Jen Geigle Johnson 16:47
But while working on the physical side of you, the mental side can really help counteract some of this stuff. And one of them is, you know, positive, mantras positive focuses a positive shift. And one of mine now, because of my experience with the weddings is just focus on the joy there is joy everywhere, and it's a gift. And it's also a right in a way we we get consequences for actions, and some of them are there waiting to be utilized. And maybe we haven't noticed them or or keyed in or welcomed them. But joy is available. And it's it's one of those things that we should just grasp onto. So that's one of my mantras. But anyway, long answer to your short question.
Jen Geigle Johnson 17:33
God has played a huge role. And he still is. And I feel like as a very independently minded person, sometimes we get placed in situations where you can't do it on your own. And it's a great life lesson that that's when you reach out and understand. And I think God approaches us in the ways that we most can relate to and understand. So he knows I'm independently minded. So often he'll give me my To Do lists, or my my directional points. As well as I always need, like the cozy warm blanket feel to so I feel like, I'm still here, I love you. And this is what you need to do. And I'm comfortable with that. And he knows that and we we just have worked out this good little way of being. Not that it's perfect. And I you know, fail sometimes in my relationship with God. But I feel like that way in that way.
Jen Geigle Johnson 18:29
He's, he's kind of found the way to reach me. And I think that's what he does. He doesn't give up and he keeps trying any finds whatever way works with us to kind of help us anyway. So that's what he did through COVID. I think he just reminded me, I'm here even though you can't feel me when I knew nothing. I just knew by faith, he was there. And then he's kind of eased me along as I try to recover through this. But in some ways, I feel a little sheepish because I do know how many people have had experienced way more than this through COVID. They've lost loved ones, and they've had debilitating hospital stays and total life change where they no longer can work. And my schedule has just been cut way back. So So I mean, the next thing I was going to mention is there's no need to plow through everything that you had planned when you're hit by something that's making it really hard. So I had to get through the book deadlines. I obviously wanted to help my daughters get married and send my son off on a mission. But after that, I can cut back and choose you know, where I'm able, you know, which which things I want to tackle and which things I don't and this is where meditation comes in a little bit.
Jen Geigle Johnson 19:43
I feel like meditation and prayer and scripture study all serve the same purpose and I feel like there's a lot you can learn and they do the same thing to your brain also. But one earlier this week, I was doing a five minute little meditation thing because I'm not very good at meditation. I know if some people do it for a long, 30 minutes or something like that, I can just do about five, and then my brain starts to go, you have so much to do right now. I feel a little meditation but but this is what I learned in my, in my five minute when I did this week, it was just one of those things where you focus on your breathing and you you calm every you know, you calm your body, and you focus on your breathing, and it just quiets the mind. And when I do that, I always have like, I was saying, there's the circling thoughts when just races in something I'm worried about.
Jen Geigle Johnson 20:37
And I realized, oh, yeah, I am worried about that. Yep, it's been bugging me. Yeah, well, here's another one. And it's really, really, it's revealing the the thoughts that try to enter a quiet space in your mind, you realize which ones are repetitive, and which ones you don't need to worry about so much anymore. And so they would come in, and I would, you know, try to quiet my brain root and just say, No, I'm only thinking about breathing right now. And I do the, you know, this five minute meditation will, a part of the meditation once you your breathing for a minute, asks you to remember a time that day where you felt that joy, and I don't know, remember what were the meditation used. But in my head, it was that joyful feeling or that happy feeling that you want to be in your life. And, and I was expecting, because I was in a work minded mode, I was expecting to think about a book launch or a good review, or a fun release. And it was just my kids. And I remember that I don't want to cry about it.
Jen Geigle Johnson 21:34
But I remember, just a thought about my daughter's really happy face. And when I had done something really fun for my son, and I had met their needs in a joyful way. And it was very moving and cold for me to remember, some of my greatest joys are my children, and they're right here. And they're growing up, I only have soon I will have two children of my six living with me instead of all six. And so anyway, it was really cool to realize through that process, I can shift out and push away those negative pointless worries that repeat themselves. And I can focus on the ideas that come when I asked myself, well, what is the you know, what are the things that bring you joy, and focus on those things, and it helps with my stress. And this is something I didn't have to worry about. I know I was probably feeling all these things.
Jen Geigle Johnson 22:28
But when you're perfectly healthy, you can handle a lot. And when things start falling apart, you need to be more aware of how these things are affecting your whole body makeup. So anyway, long story short, there's a lot you can do with thought control. Meditation does help. I think that and scripture study and prayer all work together and can serve the same purpose. And it's a way to receive revelation because you're quieting a lot of the noise. So that's just an exercise I did this week that helped me recognize I can do more things with my children and feel that joy and have that be more constant in my life. And I thought I was already doing things with the children. But I realized it's a blessing. There's so many more things I could do. And I thought in that instant of little, I don't know, just personal things that the kids would have liked that I did or done or I would have enjoyed with them. So
Tamara Anderson 23:25
Oh, I love that. Now do you use a specific app when you meditate? Or what do you use?
Tamara Anderson 23:32
We're going to take a quick break. But when we get back, we'll have more lessons, tips and things you can apply to your life. Stay tuned. How many of you out there feel like your life is chaotic, crazy, and completely awful compared to the norm? What if I were to tell you you are normal for you. I'm so excited to tell you about my book normal for me, learning to love and accept life's detours with God's help. This book took me 10 years to write. And I shared 20 years worth of lessons learned in my life detours, including being in a car accident and having two of my children diagnosed on the autism spectrum. In this book, I share the secrets of how I made it from despair to peace with God's help. I talked about being a zombie mom, living in survival mode, learning true faith, and how I debunked the myth that God doesn't give you more than you can handle. normal for me also includes a bonus diagnosis survival guide at the very end the book in which I shared 12 tips to survive and thrive in tough times. So what are you waiting for? Grab your copy of normal for me today on Amazon or on my website? Tamara KAnderson.com
Tamara Anderson 25:00
Now do you use a specific app when you meditate? Or what do you use?
Jen Geigle Johnson 25:05
Um, I, I have never found one that I would just wholeheartedly recommend across the board. I love them all. They're great. I've dabbled here and there. I don't like to pay for this kind of thing.
Tamara Anderson 25:16
Right?
Jen Geigle Johnson 25:17
Not very fair, I guess for people who spend time and energy creating product, but I have a specific meditation I'll need also I don't I like the ones that focus me towards God that don't ignore guilt, and that don't ignore areas to improve. I don't like criticizing myself, but I welcome change. I welcome repentance. So I have very specific needs. And I haven't found an app that like caters to my belief in the Gospel, as well as everything else. But this one, what was it?I don't remember?
Tamara Anderson 25:49
That's okay. That's okay. I was just curious. But I love and I'd love to pull on a couple of those things that that you talked about. first, when you were in the hospital, and you couldn't think clearly, I love that you text your husband and said, I need you to be my prayer. You know what I mean? Often we hit points in life where we need other people's help. And it's I love that you were able to reach out to your husband then and then asked your family for prayers as you were getting ready for the wedding and still just physically not feeling 100%. And your stress levels were your cortisol was super high. And and so I love just the idea. And the reminder that we're not on this journey alone. Not only do we have God on our side, but God puts people in our path that love us, and that are so willing to reach out and help us and pray for us. If we're willing to ask, and I think sometimes it it almost take swallowing your pride to say, Can I get some prayers? You know what I mean? It's true.
Jen Geigle Johnson 26:53
It's so true. Yes.
Tamara Anderson 26:55
You know, yeah. So I loved that I loved how you talk about giving yourself space, and acknowledging the thoughts that pop in while you're meditating, and then dismiss some and focusing on joy and being grateful for the people that you have in your life. Because often if we really pause and think about the people who bring us most joy, it's family. Yeah, family or super close friends. And our interactions with them are the most meaningful, right? That's what that's, that's what matters most. You know what I mean?
Jen Geigle Johnson 27:34
It's true. And, and they help too because they live with you on a day to day basis. And I have some sons, well, the one that I'm thinking of is actually on his mission right now. But he would say, you know, just in a normal day to day experience, Mom, you're feeling stressed, you know, like, I wanted for my 17 year old boy to say, right? But obviously, he was feeling the reactions to my stress, right? So he would say it and he would name it.
Jen Geigle Johnson 27:59
And I would, I would recognize your right, I am feeling stressed. And then recognizing that naming what you're feeling and expressing it actually helps you manage it. And I thought that was very intuitive of him. But I think family can help with that. And me telling my family, I am feeling these things. If I have a reaction to something going on, like I get really scared or worried about something, you know, this is why I'm feeling that way. Can you guys help me understand, you know, Mom, this is what you're doing? Or, or recognize it's not, you know, or I don't know, it's an interesting communication exercise, because I think a lot of it is just recognizing what's going on inside us and then reaching out to others and telling them, what's what you're feeling. And then they can help in what ways they can. I think it helps everybody become more emotionally aware. And I'm not an expert on any of these things. It's just been a very interesting, interesting journey. To just not feel totally in control. You know, within the course of a day, I would say I feel like I guess maybe teenagers feel like this.
Tamara Anderson 29:13
With their hormones going all over the place. Whoa. Yes, it's gotten to go through your teens again, Lucky.
Jen Geigle Johnson 29:23
So different, but But yeah, so in the course of endocrinology and visits and stuff, I feel like I'm leveling out and it's a lot better and I can feel a difference but really, and truly, it's been almost a year really of slow progress. So it's just one of those things that I might deal with for a long time. I have you know, even I now understand social anxiety and I would I'm a shy person but I'm extroverted. So I would go to people for my my love needs, you know, I need to be filled with the people even though I was shy, I would find ways to still connect But I understand now how it can be scary. And I never felt scary before only it's just maybe shy or timid. And now I feel fear sometimes about social situation.
Jen Geigle Johnson 30:10
So I have such an understanding of all my awesome introverted friends and my and my more shy friends and you know, understanding that there's just a little bit of care that can be taken for somebody who is maybe tender, and everybody puts on a great face. But it's true that inside there's a lot of turmoil, and probably just about everybody that we see. So it's interesting, what I've learned, and through the the empathy side of things to the worry, that happens when someone in the family is hurt or sick or having trouble, just the people that have reached out to my kids and my husband when I was in the hospital, and all of that I think helps everybody feel comforted, and like, Oh, this is normal, everything's gonna be fine. And that kind of thing.
Jen Geigle Johnson 30:58
Anyway, so you're right, the people around us matter. And we can be that person. And I have gained a lot of empathy in that way. And, and just to know that, there sometimes are normal answers have just pray or just read your Scriptures or the spirit will help you don't always work in the way that people wish they would. And so saying, keep going, even though you're not seeing a response right away, or push through, or the new understanding of endure to the end, or God will reach you. But it might be in a way you're not expecting or look for the joy and see the miracles that aren't always the cookie cutter versions of them. They're unique to you. So there's a lot of different shifts in language that I might use, understanding what it felt like to just not have that brain power to be able to even like formulate a full sentence.
Tamara Anderson 31:59
No, and I love I love that you brought this up, because I think sometimes people are like, Well, I've been trying, I've been trying to do those things. And I'm just not feeling it. You know what I mean? I, like you said, it's not working for me right now. And I think the interesting thing is then that you have learned to shift and that you got the download, look for the joy. This is your new assignment. You know, yes, I see you're trying, yes, I see you're doing your best to keep going even in this new normal. And it's hard. And here's what I want you to focus on, I want you to focus on finding joy.
Tamara Anderson 32:38
And it's interesting how God gave you the exact prescription of what you needed. Right, then, you know, and it's going to be different for somebody else, you know, here's what you need to do for me, when my kids were diagnosed with autism, God had to teach me, this is now normal for you, you know, quit comparing yourself to everybody else. And that was the answer I needed right then because I was so busy bemoaning my fate and looking at everybody else's normal family. So it's interesting that God will give us that little whisper of inspiration. Here's your answer. It may not be what you expected, and it may not have come in the way you wanted it to come. But try this.
Jen Geigle Johnson 33:24
Yeah, it's true, and and some things you can't fix. And I think that that is also really valuable information. And I think you, you try stubbornly to fix things first.
Tamara Anderson 33:37
Yes. You know, that bit about submitting? Right, you know, it's like, God, I know, you have the power to fix me right now. Right? Why won't you do it? And I'm sure God's looking down the years a bit. So the Jen geigle Johnson 10 years from now and it says, Because of this, you will become more compassionate, more patient, more loving, more understanding, you'll, and I'm sure those themes will probably bleed out into your books. Do you know what I mean? That the lessons you've learned because every author I've met can't help but let those lessons percolate into their writing?
Jen Geigle Johnson 34:17
Oh, for sure. First, sure, the idea of an author voice. And it doesn't matter what genre you're writing nonfiction or fiction. It's like your fingerprint on your work. And it a really expert reader can see it. And depending on how strong your voice is, as we the more we write, I think the stronger voice we, we learn. And it's hard to describe what that actually means because I could write a thriller and I could write a sweet Hallmark romance, dark romance and it would be totally different genre and it would have a different feel.
Jen Geigle Johnson 34:53
But still, there's me in there, and that's my voice that's my fingerprint on there, but And that comes from accumulated life. experience. So, in some ways, I'm really grateful I started this author journey a little later than some of my friends have, I have friends who started writing straight out of college, and they're so young and energetic as young as they are, but I am grateful for the life experience that I have. And this adds to it, I think you're right, there's a lot more to offer. When we experience you know, the different trials of life, I often say that you can't really measure the value of someone's faith, or the value of someone's empathy or their learned love, because it comes through life experience. And it's, it's precious, and it's treasured. And it just comes, you know, you, if you consider all of it, someone has learned through a really heart wrenching, hard time.
Jen Geigle Johnson 35:54
That's the price that was paid for the faith that they gave on the other side, and I can admire it, and I can't be gifted it, I can learn it. And it's really the purpose of our whole being here. And our most treasured thing that we leave with, is the person that we've become. And so it's just that, that brilliant heart, or the good state, or the learned compassion, or whatever it is, we accumulate here on this earth, those are the things that we become, and that's my treasure thing, you know, I'm working on being something. Problem is we digress like, oh, much better now than I was when I was 20. I don't even know.
Tamara Anderson 36:36
Two steps forward, one step back.
Jen Geigle Johnson 36:39
That's true. And I guess through that we learn I don't know, it's crazy to me that God sends children to imperfect people.
Tamara Anderson 36:50
We'd be in trouble if he didn't. None of us would have kids. None of us would be here, right?
Jen Geigle Johnson 36:58
Oh, we would not. So I guess it's just the plan. But it's so it's interesting. It's a journey.
Tamara Anderson 37:04
It is definitely a journey. And one of the things that I've been thinking about how you said that you have gained empathy. I've been thinking about how that kind of relates to Jesus Christ, and how he suffered for each of us on the cross and in Gethsemane. And he has perfect empathy for each of us. And and what you experienced kind of gave me just a tiny sip of a taste of the love and empathy the Savior has for each of us, his children, you know, that he sees you. And he sees me and he sees every person who's listening to this podcast and every person around the world in an empathetic roll because he's their Savior. And so, as we go through life experiences and develop empathy for other people, don't forget that that savior has that same empathy for you. So awesome.
Jen Geigle Johnson 37:57
It really is so great. And I feel like that reminds me in an effort to understand others and to feel empathy for them. It really helps to know their story, and understand where they're coming from, you know, just the power of a story is just really important. And what's cool about the Savior's empathy is his is emboldened because he knows all of our stories. And so as we try to emulate him, and to learn, to love and to have that charity, just taking the time to learn and listen and hear what someone's saying, is powerful. And I think that learning people's stories is what helps gift us a little bit with more of that empathy. Whether or not we actually experienced it ourselves. We can experience through others a lot of things. That's why I love fiction, you can experience all kinds of stuff through a story that you don't ever have to experience on your own. And your brain registers. It is some kind of experience your brain reacts when you're reading. So I feel like it's really useful as just an exercise in empathy, but experienced, also helps. But I do feel like he has that perfect knowledge. And it's interesting. You asked what my favorite Bible verses I don't know. No,
Tamara Anderson 39:18
no, I was just gonna get to that. Tell me your favorite Bible verse, please
Jen Geigle Johnson 39:22
It leads right into this. So I have I have a lot of favorite Bible verses, but I teach a seminary class. So I teach Old Testament right now and I so I'm really deep into Old Testament, and lately with the whole study we've been doing about Joseph in Egypt and all the trials he went through. I just love that in Genesis 39, repeated twice is and the Lord was with Joseph, that sounds so simple, but if you consider his life, so he's sold into slavery, and it says, And the Lord was with Joseph, and then he gets put into prison, and it says, And the Lord was with Joseph and I had Powerful for so many reasons.
Jen Geigle Johnson 40:01
But to me, he was, it was like, you could see an example of the Lord carrying someone in the midst of a trial, you know, lightning, where he could help bring him where he where he did, and helping Joseph to have the influence he needed to have, even when, at a surface level, it was terrible. Like he had, he was lonely, and he had no one and he was sold by his family, and probably his dad thought he was dead. I mean, really, and truly, a lot was going wrong. But just that phrase, and the Lord was with Joseph says so much, because you can't see it at all. Until the next in the later on in the verse when he's like, he rose to the top of the household, or, you know, he was able to be the top prison guard. I mean, talk about a positive attitude. You get to be the top prison guard.
Jen Geigle Johnson 41:00
But, anyway, it's powerful to me lately, because I just thought, yes, the Lord is with you. And I really feel like he's in the little details of our life, and he will reach out to us in the way we understand. And one of the things I think we all want to do is feel like we're making a difference. We're doing what the Lord sent us here to do, we're somehow made, you know, making an imprint somewhere doing what we're supposed to do. And I think if you look at Joseph in the example that he was, you can see how the Lord is with you. Even when you can't feel him like me in the hospital, even when Joseph still in prison, or he's still a slave. He, the Lord helped him and eventually we saw the miracles, we saw why he did all those things. And, you know, years, years, later, years, decades, so I feel like that's something to remember that the Lord is with you. Just like he was with Joseph, and there's a purpose and it may not show up for a long time. And that's okay. Because that's, that's just sometimes the way that he works. So that's why that's my late my latest favorite Bible verse. So I
Tamara Anderson 42:09
love that and I love, I love that you've been able to find comfort in that in your journey, right? That God is with you on your journey. Now, Jen, there's going to be people who are listening to us talk and they they're like, oh, please tell me where I can find Jen and her book. So where can we connect with you? Where can we find more about your books? Please, please, please share.
Jen Geigle Johnson 42:32
Oh, thank you. I love to share this information. You can spell my maiden name, you can pretty much find me anywhere. It's the beauty of my odd name. So Jen Geigle Johnson and if you just GEIGLE I'm, that's my website, Jen Geigle johnson.com. From there, you can find me on Amazon. If you just type in even if you spell it wrong. Amazon will take you right to me. So I have, oh, I don't know maybe 10 or so titles at a does any depth of the desert books or Seagull bookstores if you were looking for my actual book product on a shelf and online in their stores? How about oh, I'm on social media all over the place. So
Tamara Anderson 43:16
she is and she has some really awesome real, so you gotta go check them out. I'll be sure to make sure we link Jen and her website and her social media profile in the show notes of today's episode. But Jen, thank you so much for coming on the show today. Thank you for sharing your journey, and for reminding us to look for kindness and that God is with us through thick and through thin.
Jen Geigle Johnson 43:39
It was such a pleasure to be here. Tamara. You're an inspiration to me. And I hope you keep doing what you're doing. I think you're making a difference in this good world, bringing hope to all of us.
Tamara Anderson 43:48
Hey, thanks so much for listening to today's show. If you like what you heard, subscribe so you can get your weekly dose of powerful stories of hope. I know there are many of you out there who are going through a hard time, and I hope you found useful things that you can apply to your own life in today's podcast. If you'd like to access the show notes of today's show, please visit my website stories of hope podcast.com. There you will find a summary of today's show, the transcript and one of my favorite takeaways. You know, if someone kept coming to mind during today's episode, perhaps that means that you should share this episode with them. Maybe there was a story shared or quote or a scripture verse that they really really need to hear. So go ahead and share this podcast. May God bless you, especially if you're struggling with hope to carry on and have the strength to keep going. When things get tough. Remember to walk with Christ and He will help you bear the burden. And above all else, Remember God loves you.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai